Sodium Tallowate

[mastermute]

Today I, when I passed the shaving aisle, I picked up a PalmOlive Shaving stick. For some reason I read the ingredients and it said Potassium Tallowate and Sodium Tallowate... I was probably naïve to expect a product called "PalmOlive" to be made from Palm oil and Olive oil.

It gave a great lather, and that is one of the features of tallowates that is prefered in shaving soaps.

What do you think of animal products in soaps?
Do you mind it?
Do you avoid?
Do you actively act against?
Or don't you give a pigs ear about it?

How "enviromental impact aware" are you in your shaving? Or is it "hands off" for such things?

[sparky5693]

Doesn't bother me at all. However, if I recall correctly, the animal based products are often pore clogging.

[Scorpio]

We use beef tallow in about 95% of the soaps we make. The only time we do not use beef tallow is when we make Olive oil soap. I will say that all the tallow base soaps we make contain 100% natural ingredients with no chemicals, additives or preservatives.

So that is as environmentally aware as I am going to get. I dont act against it, avoid it or mind it...matter of fact we just bought another large tub of beef tallow. As far as environmentally aware in shaving, well, I dont use any of that can goo crap nor do I use any of those multi-blade behemoths made of plastic.

I'm sure Issy will chime in with a more in-depth answer about tallow in soap products.

Raf

[mercV12]

I don't care about the use of animals in making good products. Doesn't bother my one iota!! I enjoy beef, fish and foul immensly and could never be vegetarian.

[qhsdoitall]

Not an issue. It's when live animals made dead on purpose are involved I have an issue.

[Queen of Blades]

Not an issue. It's when live animals made dead on purpose are involved I have an issue.

Ummm....maybe I'm tired, but are you saying road kill is ok to use, but not killing animals for making products? :confused:

[Lyrt]

I think he meant killing animals just for fun or tallow is wrong, while using tallow when it's a by-product of food industry is not a problem.

[Michael]

Leave him alone...he's not over the gelding thing yet! :eek:

[qhsdoitall]

Leave him alone...he's not over the gelding thing yet! :eek:

Hey, it's been ummm....1, 2, 3, 4...wait, I need to take off my shoes and socks...11, 12...years. Where was I? You know where a man's brains are don't ya? Well, there ya go.

Yukio, has it right. Food industry and rendering byproducts is OK. Raise, kill and use is not.

[Queen of Blades]

Yukio, has it right. Food industry and rendering byproducts is OK. Raise, kill and use is not.

I still don't understand.

Don't farmers raise cattle, kill them, for food, and use every part they can make money from? Including the tallow? :confused:

[Bill]

Well... there ya have it. And all this time I thought Sodium Tallowate was what they sqwooshed out of kangaroo boogers that lived near the ocean.

[rick]

I thought it was some kinda new fangled food seasoning.

:pot

[qhsdoitall]

I still don't understand.

Don't farmers raise cattle, kill them, for food, and use every part they can make money from? Including the tallow? :confused:

That's a byproduct of the food industry so that is OK.

Here is a not OK. Raising minks for fur coats.
Here is an OK. Prime Rib done to medium rare. What they did with the rest of the animal not an issue. :D
Here is a grey issue. Raising animals specifically for medical research.
Here is not an OK. Premarin.

[Crag]

I am a STRONG member of PETA, People Eating The Animals, and when I see a truckload of cattle on the highway my first thought is "lunch", so as long as their is no cruelty involved I'm all for the use of animal products in soaps, besides, if they didn't use them, they would just go to waste.

Obviously, I do not condone the use of products from animals on the Endangered Species List, and I am a strong Conservationist, but not a tree hugger. I believe that Conservation means controlling numbers of healthy species through predation and hunting, so I actually look for soaps made with tallowates. I use them almost every shave, and will use a glycerin product to clear my pores on the weekend.

*** Completely Off-Topic***As for Premarin...About 5 years ago I helped rescue 8 foals from a PMU farm in Florida, that were slated for slaughter, through HorseAid. These horses were not Quarters, but Tennessee Walkers. For more info on Premarin see http://www.premarin.org/.

[mastermute]

So, it seems like Sodium/Potassium Tallowate and other animal products aren't an issue around here ;)

But how do you percieve tallow/lard- , glycerine- (shouldn't that really be glycerol?) and oil- based soaps? Any favourites? Olive oil? How much does the ingredients concern you, if at all?

[Lionhearted]

Here is a grey issue. Raising animals specifically for medical research.
So you think the life of a mouse or rat is more important than that of a human child?

Richard (retired M.D.)

P.S. I use only glycerine-based soaps because I find they make the best lather for me. The one I use most often is made with only three ingredients added to an all-vegetable glycerine base: olive oil, vitamin E and an essential oil for scent.

[Scorpio]

But how do you percieve tallow/lard- , glycerine- (shouldn't that really be glycerol?) and oil- based soaps? Any favourites? Olive oil? How much does the ingredients concern you, if at all?

Well, I believe we already talked about tallow base soaps. As for Vegetable and glycerin base soaps, I dont mind those either. I like Olive oil soaps as they are moisturizing specially during the winter months. Again, I stay with all natural ingredients soaps.

Favorite soaps...there is a thread in the shaving soap section but I'll mention a couple: Cambridge both CP and glycerin, MWF, Tabac, Trumpers, DR. Harris, TSD to name a few.

Raf

[qhsdoitall]

So you think the life of a mouse or rat is more important than that of a human child?

Richard (retired M.D.)

P.S. I use only glycerine-based soaps because I find they make the best lather for me. The one I use most often is made with only three ingredients added to an all-vegetable glycerine base: olive oil, vitamin E and an essential oil for scent.

Nope, it was a general grey area comment not a hard personal opinion. No animal life is more important than a person's when push comes to shove. We eat animals right? For some people the reason it's grey is that it does not stop at rats and mice does it? Chimps are included are they not? Is there a line at all? Who knows. It's not for me to judge. At this point I ask that people be a little more careful about their responses. Not once have I questioned anyone elses opinion in this thread. I ask that you stop commenting on mine. Just state your own opinion. OK? This is my final response to this thread.

[Queen of Blades]

At this point I ask that people be a little more careful about their responses. Not once have I questioned anyone elses opinion in this thread. I ask that you stop commenting on mine. Just state your own opinion. OK? This is my final response to this thread.

I apologize if I offended you, Rich.

It was not my intent to bash your opinions at all. Your comments simply left me confused and curious. And I wished for a clearer understanding of what you were saying.

I'm sorry.

[Lionhearted]

For some people the reason it's grey is that it does not stop at rats and mice does it? Chimps are included are they not? Is there a line at all? Who knows. It's not for me to judge. At this point I ask that people be a little more careful about their responses. Not once have I questioned anyone elses opinion in this thread. I ask that you stop commenting on mine. Just state your own opinion. OK?
I really don't see the point of posting an opinion in a public forum if you're unwilling for anyone to comment on it. If you're too sensitive to hear comments about your opinions, then it might be best to keep them to yourself.

Note that I didn't question your opinion or make a comment on it but only asked a question for further clarification.

Chimps are included as well as human volunteers. Is a chimp's life more valuable than a rat's?

Fortunately, there's one gray area on animal product usage that can be eliminated. In the early 1980s Gillette's research department using relatively large scale double blind testing found that nylon bristles lather the best and feel the most comfortable on the skin. This news apparently didn't reach many brush buyers.

Richard

[mastermute]

Fortunately, there's one gray area on animal product usage that can be eliminated. In the early 1980s Gillette's research department using relatively large scale double blind testing found that nylon bristles lather the best and feel the most comfortable on the skin. This news apparently didn't reach many brush buyers.

Are nylon bristle brushes available today?

[IsaacRN]

yes.....there are a wide variety of brushes that are available. MenU makes one....Plisson..Muehle..

Not sure who else

[Lionhearted]

Not all synthetics are pure nylon but the idea is the same. Besides the ones mentioned above, Omega, Body Shop, Culmak, Delong, Edwin Jagger, Salter, Taylor of Old Bond Street and Rooney make synthetic brushes.

Men-U and Taylor usually rank the best in reviews. As in all things shaving YMMV. Some are soft, some are prickly, some are stiff, some are floppy, some are $10, some are $50, etc.

As for my own opinion on the use of animals, I see nothing wrong with killing animals for food and I've killed (and eaten) elk, deer and moose. I see nothing wrong with killing dangerous animals and I've killed rattlesnakes, scorpions, and a rabid possum. I see nothing wrong with mercy killings and I've killed a horse and dogs. I see nothing wrong in killing vermin and I've killed mice and rats. I do see something wrong with killing only for sport and taking only the head or antlers. I see something wrong with killing for fur or hides in modern society but not in some primitive societies. I see nothing wrong with ethical medical research including the use of human embryos. I see nothing wrong with using animal products for shaving accessories — brushes, soaps, creams, colognes, etc.

Richard